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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2009-09-15 City Council Regular MinutesCITY COUNCIL REGULAR MEETING SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 The regular meeting of the City Council of the City of Apache Junction, Arizona, was held on September 15, 2009, at the Apache Junction City Council Chambers pursuant to the notice required by law. CALL TO ORDER Mayor Insalaco called the meeting to order at 7:04 p.m. INVOCATION Councilmember Wilson gave the Invocation. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE Councilmember Dietz led the Pledge of Allegiance. ROLL CALL Councilmembers Present:Mayor Insalaco Vice Mayor Eck Councilmember Barker Councilmember Coleman Councilmember Dietz Councilmember Serdy Councilmember Wilson Staff Present:City Manager George Hoffman Assistant City Manager Bryant Powell City Clerk Kathleen Connelly City Attorney Joel Stern Public Safety Director Jerald Monahan City Engineer Giao Pham Public Works Director David Fern Development Svcs. Director Brad Steinke Planning Manager Fred Baker REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 1 OF 30 Others Present:Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias ACCEPTANCE OF CONSENT AGENDA )Vice Mayor Eck MOVED THAT THE CONSENT AGENDA BE ACCEPTED AS PRESENTED; AND THAT APPROVAL BE GIVEN FOR THE FIRST AMENDMENT TO THE SUPERSTITION VISTAS AREA STUDY FINANCIAL PARTICIPATION AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE CITY OF APACHE JUNCTION, THE EAST VALLEY PARTNERSHIP, PINAL COUNTY AND OTHER EAST VALLEY CITIES IN THE AMOUNT OF $40,000 TO CONTINUE PARTICIPATION IN THE STUDY THROUGH ITS COMPLETION IN DECEMBER 2010; AND THAT AUTHORIZATION BE GIVEN FOR THE MAYOR TO SIGN THE AGREEMENT PENDING FINAL APPROVAL AS TO FORM BY THE CITY ATTORNEY. Councilmember Dietz SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. AWARDS, PRESENTATIONS AND COMMUNICATIONS None. ANNOUNCEMENT OF CURRENT EVENTS None. CITY MANAGER'S REPORT City Manager George Hoffman commented on the budget signed by the governor. PUBLIC HEARINGS ORDINANCE NO. 1349, ESTABLISHING THE SPEED LIMIT ON DELAWARE DRIVE BETWEEN WEST APACHE TRAIL AND SUPERSTITION BOULEVARD )City Engineer Giao Pham briefed the council on the item. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 2 OF 30 Councilmember Barker asked if they are going to look at the turn situation at the northwest corner at the same time. City Engineer Giao Pham stated that will happen at this time.They have already put the speed limit signs up and restriped the intersection.The plans are set up, the other signs should be placed in the next two weeks, and the striping south of the intersection where WalMart and McDonalds are will also be done. Vice Mayor Eck asked what she was referring to with the turn on the northwest side. Councilmember Barker stated it has two lanes.The left side you can go straight and the right one you can only turn right. Vice Mayor Eck commented she is talking about the southbound traffic. Councilmember Barker stated that is correct. City Engineer Giao Pham stated since it is one phasing in that intersection, they are going to have the movement where you can go through on both southbound lanes and they can turn either eastbound or westbound. Councilmember Serdy asked if he could ask a question of the police chief. City Attorney Joel Stern stated because it deals with traffic and is a public hearing he can ask him some questions. Councilmember Serdy commented it is down to 25 mph from 30 mph, but we do not strictly enforce 25 mph so 25 mph will mean 30 mph.He asked if there is a policy of 5 mph; there is always a lot of speculation. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 3 OF 30 Department of Public Safety Director Jerald Monahan stated they want to allow the officers to use discretion depending on all the available information surrounding the circumstances of traffic enforcement.In this particular area, their statistics do not show a significant traffic problem there, but we support what public works is doing because we believe it is preventive.By making a 5 mile per hour adjustment, they think it will pay some dividends in calming an area that has now become a neighborhood concern.The officers in this area, when this change occurs, should certainly give adequate warning before they begin any type of heavy enforcement.His experience in this area is that heavy enforcement would not be necessary, but the change could call attention to the drivers. Vice Mayor Eck commented he feels that 25 on the north side is very different than 25 on the south of the Trail where they have the double lanes.He sees traffic going 30 to 35 and it does not have the appearance of going fast, whereas if you are going 35 on the north side in that smaller, skinny lane, it is very noticeable. Department of Public Safety Director Jerald Monahan commented one of the other items mentioned last night was the placement of no truck traffic signs.The combination of the adjustment of the speed limit and the no truck traffic, with the research public works has done, should have a positive effect in this part of town. Mayor Insalaco commented if they are going to have that road redone, they need to keep those big trucks from cutting through that quarter mile.People are complaining about those tractor trailers cutting through from Superstition to Apache Trail and vice versa.They do not belong in that neighborhood.It will deteriorate that road even more. Department of Public Safety Director Jerald Monahan stated he believes he is correct on that. Mayor Insalaco opened the public hearing on the item. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 4 OF 30 Mr. Noel Benoist, 900 N. San Marcos #79, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He commented on his visit to Chicago, where the downtown speed limits are 15 or 25 miles per hour, created a more family- oriented area and encouraged the speed limit be lowered here for the entire downtown area. Mr. Elliott Fisher, 547 E. Quail, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He stated they need basic bus transportation downtown and commented he would consider an initiative if something is not done soon. Mayor Insalaco closed the public hearing with no one else wishing to speak.He reopened the item to council discussion. Vice Mayor Eck commented they have been told the bus service is going to come out to Signal Butte and Southern within the next 2 years, whereas before they would not go east of Power.That is the best they have been able to come up with. Mayor Insalaco closed the discussion with no further comments and called for a motion. Vice Mayor Eck MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO. 1349 BE READ BY TITLE ONLY WITH THE EMERGENCY CLAUSE AND THE READING OF THE ENTIRE ORDINANCE BE WAIVED. Councilmember Dietz SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly read the ordinance by title only with the emergency clause. Vice Mayor Eck MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO. 1349, AS READ BY THE CITY CLERK, BE APPROVED AND ADOPTED. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 5 OF 30 Councilmember Dietz SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. ORDINANCE NO. 1345, AMENDING THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE, CHAPTER 1 ZONING ORDINANCE BY AMENDING ARTICLE 6 GENERAL PROVISIONS AND EXCEPTIONS,SECTION 6.0130 EQUINE REGULATIONS )Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias briefed the council on the item. Councilmember Coleman commented he read something about 2.5 acres.He asked where that is. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated it is on page 4 of the cover memo.It is the very last statement.It states if the council desires to add a provision limiting the number of RV camping spaces for 2.5 acre parcels, the following provision may be added:the horse boarding facility shall allow for no more than blank number of first come/first serve RV camping spaces for every 2.5 gross acres. Councilmember Coleman asked if that is in the ordinance itself. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated it is not.They can add that if they would like to. Councilmember Coleman asked if there was any mention of acreage at all in the ordinance. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated there is not.He knows that item came up last night.If he heard the council correctly, there was some discussion about allowing horse boarding on a minimum of 5 acres.If they would like to punch that in, they should put it in number 13 Rentals, camping sites for temporary accommodations for recreational REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 6 OF 30 vehicles, etc., may be allowed, and they can plug in, on 5 gross acres or larger commercial hots e boarding properties.That provision of RV camping would apply only to larger boarding facilities. Mayor Insalaco opened the public hearing on the item. Mr. Jeff Watson, 2140 N. Warner, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He stated he has never had any issues with the boarding stables across the street from him and they have RV camping there.The number will be limited as it prevents them from boarding more horses. Mr. Giles Patten, 2872 N. Hidalgo Street, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He is a retired real estate agent and commented on the denial of some councilmembers on the knowledge of Lost Dutchman Gardens ever being put in and asking when the builder he worked for was going to build a high density subdivision in a low density area.He commented it seems there are members of the council that are trying to drive the horse people out of the city and trying to cover up bad real estate transactions by any members of the council.He supported RV camping for those that have the space. Mr. Jim Foster, 1841 E. Tepee, No Fly Zone Stables, addressed the council.He commented last night they were talking about the 2.5 acre parcels in the city.He does not know how many would want RV camping, but he took a 2.5 acre parcel and put a house, 6 stall mare motel, small arena and 6 RV spots smaller than suggested, and landscaping.It fits.He does not want any, but they should not deny it for them that do want it.He believes this will come up again. Ms. Michelle Leach, 416 N. Idaho Road, Apache Junction, addressed the council.She moved here instead of Scottsdale because of the city was horse- friendly.She urged them not to become Scottsdale East.Their friends with disposable incomes will go to Wickenburg, Benson, Florence or other destinations.We have one golf course but unlimited hiking, biking and horseback riding trails.She had talked to the mayor during the elections and he seemed like he REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 7 OF 30 wanted to become more western and attract more business.She added horse manure dries up and blows away and a horse will jump a five foot fence.Feed is expensive and they need to be able to protect their investments, so they need cargo containers. Boarding stables may be able to attract customers with the ability to have owners stay at the same facility. Mr. Noel Benoist, 900 N. San Marcos #379, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He commented horse taxis, horse and buggy rides, horse-drawn mass transportation with 14 passengers are also downtown in Chicago. He commented he started the horse boarding in 1990 and bought a starving horse at an auction.He was the Diekman's first boarder.He gave a brief history on that site.He suggested limiting the amount of campers on a site. Mr. John Kantowski, 835 W. Windsong, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He grew up in Chicago and goes back there to visit.They do not have 15 mph except around the parks by the lake.He urged them not to do what the City of Chicago does to the horses that are downtown because they have taxes, licenses, and the horses are not allowed to defecate on the street.They can only stay on certain streets.He has horses and he likes to see his wife have a good time riding down the street.Keep it like it was before. Mr. Elliott Fisher, 547 E. Quail, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He commented he was originally against it because of his history with the city regarding a rental room in his sister's room.Here they are going to start having rental spaces for RVs in rural areas which some people would disagree with.There is a general plan for a reason.He questioned whether they are in the business of horse boarding or RV boarding, where the line will be drawn and who will monitor it.He was concerned with how many people, vehicles and horses could be in one area and still be safe in air quality, water quality, etc.There have to be some standards on that.He requested they have some teeth in the ordinance so that they can control it. Mr. Conrad Pisinski, 1069 W. 14th Avenue, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He stated REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 8 OF 30 the horsemen want to have trailers on their properties, and that most of these people have been staying in local mobile home parks that are going to be moving there. Vice Mayor Eck stated they have not. Mr. Conrad Pisinski commented these local parks may have additional spaces now and they will look at what is going on.They may then come to the council and see about taking 2.5 acres in the corner of their properties to put up a barn for horses so that their people can have their horses on the property.All they would need is 2.5 acres.He asked if the horsemen would like that, and if they give the horsemen the right, how are they going to stop the mobile home parks from wanting the same thing. Ms. Maria Ewell, 1330 W. Roundup, Apache Junction, addressed the council.She stated she appreciated each of them taking the time to truly consider the proposal.She encouraged them to make the permit process and development fees or impact fees applicable to this if they do decide to allow RVs.She commented they should not let anyone tell them that only the horsemen in this town elected them and support them. Mr. Daniel Washburn, 2855 N. Hidalgo, Apache Junction, addressed the council.He commented there is a stable 300' away from him that allows those vehicles and it has been handled well.It brings in more revenue for the city and they leave by April.He would at least allow those who are currently doing it to continue doing it.This is recognized as a horse community and these individuals that are doing this have money.Allowing them to remain would help the community. Superstition Blvd. #46, Apache She stated she has sat through zoning commission and the city the horse community people say horse, one does not like them. things about planning on doing Ms. Sandra Maxwell, 2650 W. Junction, addressed the council. the meetings at the planning and council and is tired of hearing that if one does not have a She is concerned when she hears this, they have not done it yet, but she finds on the websites and in magazines advertisements REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 9 OF 30 for RV sites.The advertisements sound like the KOA.She does not mind the business or the horse boarding; it is an asset to the community.But she feels they need to be fair to everyone. If they get special privileges, so should everyone else.She would like for the artists' community to not have to pay taxes or have permits.She does not want home -based businesses to have to pay for permits and taxes when they barely eke through. She sees it as a way of getting around things.She could see others suing the city to get the same rights.She does not see the equality happening. Mayor Insalaco closed the public hearing with no one else wishing to speak and reopened the item to council discussion. Councilmember Barker commented she did not want to address the comments as she believes those people who were angry said things out of anger and she will presume that is the reason for it.She sees horse boarding with RV camping as an opportunity.She thinks it is an enterprise that is trying hard to get its roots into the rural part of the city.She realizes and understands that there are high density pockets there, but it does not prohibit them from trying to maintain the low density as much as they possibly can. She does not think they have to give up low density to put in RVs.The density for that zoning is 0 to 1.She is amenable to a 5 acre minimum with 5 RVs.It is 5 acres so the zoning code would call for 5 of them.She would give the personal home a bye and just let it go.She believes that would work.However, the issue of impact or development fees was brought up, which could present some problems to us.She asked for Joel or Brad to explain how they would impact this particular type of business. City Attorney Joel Stern stated Brad is the development fee administrator.We have a development fee code that sets forth the types of uses that development fees are to be charged for.There is some discretion in part of the ordinance and he will let Brad go through that. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated they discussed a little bit last night how REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 10 OF 30 development fees affect this particular issue.In his opinion, the council may be taken off the hook on this issue.He is responsible for administering the development fee ordinance. There are two things that apply in this instance.If there is a new use that is listed on their schedule, which identified about 16 or 17 land uses and the applicable development fee for that land use, then he is obligated to assess that fee to that land use.If a new use is not specifically identified on this list, then he must, according to the ordinance, shall apply the category of use set forth in the applicable fee schedule that he believes is most similar to the proposed use.There are two tests.The first is if any of the land uses on the list are specifically identified as RV.They have an RV park.If an interpretation is made that it is the use that fits this schedule, that fee is $5,825 per space.If it is not the interpretation, then he would have to calculate what the most similar use is.If they approve the ordinance, and someone comes before the city for a conditional use permit for RV camping, and that time he would be forced to calculate what the fee is.The best thing he can tell them now, it would fall somewhere between the range of a lodging unit, which is $2,877 per unit, and the RV park which is $5,825. Councilmember Barker commented that would be per space. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated that is correct.He does not believe he has the discretion to ignore that in the ordinance.The city attorney may have a different opinion on that, but that is his opinion as he reads this ordinance. City Attorney Joel Stern stated he believes Brad is correct.He would have to assess, look at all the facts, those facts would be what would come with the conditional use permit, he would have to look at the number of spaces, where they are placed, the amenities, and a comparison of the RV camping use to the other use that is the most comparable.It would be his discretion where it would fall between the two.He thinks that is how it would work.He does not think they can exempt development fees in this ordinance. They could put it in there, but he would probably say it would not be legal. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 11 OF 30 Councilmember Barker commented it would cost someone with 5 acres $25,000 to have the 5 RV spaces.That completely prohibits the business.She does not believe anyone in their right mind would do the business. She asked if there was anything they could do, such as adding a category to the impact fees.She does not understand what things make up the development fees and how they are calculated. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated the law reads that they are allowed to assess a fee for the proportionate impact the development places upon us.It is a one time fee.The biggest portion of that is for roads, which is 85%.There is also a fee for general government, which is the work that we do in processing and maintaining these developments, for the police department, parks and recreation and the library.There are very well established formulas that apply to different types of land uses and they have been going on for 25 to 30 years.The science is fairly regimented.We hire a consultant that helps us to find these fees.We would have to assess what that proposal is, what the relevant impact is, and then assess a fee for that proportionate impact.There has to be a connection between that new use and the impact it places on the city.They can amend the development fee ordinance; they have done it before.If they are asking if they can require a lower fee than is proportionate for one form of land use while the others have to pay the 100% fee, that is a legal question he is not prepared to answer tonight. City Attorney Joel Stern stated there might be an issue because the state just passed a bill that the governor just signed that said they cannot raise development fees for the next two years.They have put a moratorium on them.Whether that includes a new category would be a gray area.He would have to research it.He does not think it even addresses that issue. Councilmember Dietz asked if it would actually be adding a development fee since they are adding a category. Councilmember Barker commented they would not be raising it. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 12 OF 30 City Attorney Joel Stern stated he does not know if it addresses that issue.It stated they cannot increase the current development fee.It does not take them back, they cannot increase it for the next 2 years. Vice Mayor Eck asked if they can decrease them. City Attorney Joel Stern stated they can if they have someone who says there is a legitimate purpose for reducing them because the costs are less. Councilmember Coleman commented development fees, in general, are intended to cover the actual cost to the city of the development. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated that is correct. Councilmember Coleman commented if they do not collect at 100%, in fact, the city would be subsidizing with taxpayer money the difference. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated that is correct. Councilmember Coleman stated all of that has to be studied carefully with the values placed on it that if it is challenged in court where we are charging more than the actual cost, then the city would be told it is benefitting more than the actual cost and that they cannot do. That is why the studies are in place. Development Services Director Brad Steinke stated that is correct.The strict needs assessment needs to be done. Councilmember Coleman commented in order to have growth pay for itself, those development fees need to be charged.He does not believe growth actually pays for itself.He believes it should be charged for what they charge RV parks. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 -PAGE 13 OF 30 City Attorney Joel Stern stated there is also the temporary nature of these spaces.If they limit the number of months they can have them, then that figures into Brad's calculation.It would be a one time fee. Councilmember Coleman commented he would like to address a couple of things that were said earlier.Mr. Patten was probably referring to him as he did ask Mr. Patten when Mr. Call would come back into the community and build some more because he felt like the subdivision that he built was quality and in a good place.He does not remember asking when he would come in and build high density uses in our low density areas.He does not remember saying that.But he did ask when Mr. Call would come back.He resents the statement that the council is trying to drive horses out.This ordinance does not change anything that has not been on the books.It is asking to add something that is not currently allowed, which is the RVs.They are not currently allowed.They are not currently allowed to have camping and events in those low density areas.To him, over the long term, which is hopefully what they are planning for, it could have a real negative impact on the low density areas of the community. De facto, it can turn them into high density uses up to the north and the east where they have tried to maintain the low density along the horse trails.There was another lady that stated Scottsdale East; he is so tired of hearing that.The problem in Scottsdale was not that they had money come into the community.The problem was they did not adequately plan for and keep the connectivity of their horse trails.He believes they can have both.We can have that connective element, plan for it, and keep the routes to the Superstitions open.Keep places for people to ride, as that is what he thought was the main objective in those areas.He is not trying to become like Scottsdale, but he thinks they can learn a lot from their history and their past.They used to call themselves "The West's Most Western Town", and he does not want to have that happen here.He does not want the low density areas to go away. It is interesting that reference has been made to Wickenburg; that we will drive them out and they will go to Wickenburg. Wickenburg's ordinance says 10 acres minimum to have camping. The one he is looking at says the resort is about a half mile south of town along the highway and by the Hassayampa River. They have 100 RV sites.That is because they are on 10 acres. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL :SEPTEMBER 1.5, 2009 _PAGE 14 OF 30 They require 10 acre minimums there.Pinal County also requires 10 acres minimums for that.The reason is if they are having events and those kinds of activities, they need some kind of buffer that is more than six feet.He feels that if they are going to make everything even and as equal as possible, that the development fee should be in place and it should be the same as what RV parks pay, or we will have people trying to come in and put in a de facto RV park but claim it is a commercial boarding stable.He goes back to the history where we had a couple of people come in and say they want to charge for boarding horses and there is no legal way they could do it then and asked for some help to be able to do it.They thought they did it with the commercial boarding permit.There have been problems with the enforcement of it, but that is what they thought they were doing.They were allowing them to board extra horses.We have no limit in the city on how many horses you can have.We were allowing them to board and charge for it.The reference he made last night was the camel has got his nose under the tent and now we want to have RV parking, camping and events.We are pretty much going high density uses in these low density rural areas. He has no property other than the one he lives in and he is not biased one way or the other, but he thinks that in the long term, if they are really going to protect the low density areas of this community, they need to really take a look at what goes in north of Superstition and to the east along with the "Y" area.He thinks this is a huge step in the wrong direction.He remembered in 2007 they had a huge concern from the horse community about a 20 acre piece going in kitty corner to the rodeo grounds.He was told at that time that low density meant one unit per 1.25 acres.That should be our goal and that is what we should keep.He was not told that it would be okay if they are rental units.He is having a hard time figuring out why he is now anti-horse because he is trying to protect those low density areas. Councilmember Dietz commented he totally agrees with Councilmember Coleman. Vice Mayor Eck commented there have been a lot of negative comments about not being horsemen and their horsemen's rights being lost.He is tired of hearing about horsemen's rights being lost because they are fighting for horsemen's rights all the time.They always have REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 15 OF 30 been.He has been on the council for 12 years, which is about the average now.To make comments about going with the eagles and not a bunch of turkeys and building high density subdivisions and that, if you are in real estate you would realize there are different zonings.They might have low density.The general plan has low density north of Tepee, but that did not mean there was already previously higher density zoning in that area.That is why you see the higher density parts that are there.They did not change the zoning on it. Some of the things they have done through the years are like the beautiful subdivision that could have gone in southeast of arena.He thinks they had much more to offer at 18 units rather than 20 with the horse trails through there, but the horse people were telling him no.They wanted one per 1.25 acres. That is what the council followed.We are trying to follow what we are being asked.Many of the things such as fence heights are being discussed, and they are being discussed for horse people.They are not being discussed for anybody else.Cargo containers were discussed for horse people.Every community we have looked at has a 10 acre minimum for the horse boarding and yet they say we are not trying to do something that is right for horse community.Our rodeo grounds are beautiful and are now being used for public riding use.We do not have any limits. If you move to the county, you can have 2 horses per acre.If you stay in Apache Junction, you can have 20.The $88 million equestrian trail system that the city is trying to establish from Meridian between Lost Dutchman and McKellips all the way out to Goldfield and Mountain View on top is something they are trying to protect so that there is plenty of riding room.It is a mile wide.He is not sure they will ever be able to protect that mile wide, but they are making the effort.So they have 9 out of 10 things, but if we do not do the tenth thing, then they are not getting what they wanted.That is not true.He commented Daniel had something good to say and he lives 300' away and it does not bother him.He lived in the same area with the same stable and there was another about 300' away and it did not bother him either. They all have different thought it was nice and Now, he feels like, and threshold of a change. an event or to stay for horse trailers that the They also had a very large roping arena. likes and dislikes, and he liked it.He that it brought something to the area. he said it last night, they are on the People used to bring their horses out to the winter.Now they have $100,000 horses live in and they live in and REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 16 OF 30 there is no current solution as to where we are going to put those.He does not think the development fees will make it a rational choice.He does not have the answers, but he thinks they are in turmoil because of this demand in how people live with their horses now.Wickenburg has much more rural property than we do if you go outside the inner part of the community. He would be willing to try to find some kind of solution, but it does get frustrating when you get criticized for all the things you do not do when it is just, in fact, the opposite. Councilmember Barker commented at one point Councilmember Coleman stated this could create a high density.She thinks they could avoid that by mandating that the density be of the zone.If the zone is low density and calls for "x" amount, then that is all they can put in.She thinks that does shelter that density.She thinks that takes care of it.She truly believes this is a business that is going to become very valuable to our community in the future. She would like to see a way for them to work this out, even if they have to come back and do it some more so that they can figure something out. Vice Mayor Eck commented he does not see a solution tonight.She is saying if it is general rural and ten acres, then she would allow 8 sites for the 10 acres. Councilmember Barker commented she thought it was 0 to 1. Vice Mayor Eck commented 1 is R-143. Councilmember Wilson commented he would like to emphasize that most of these facilities are talking about limited use.They would not be year round campers.They should only be there 3 to 6 months. If you take the one legal facility that we already have in town that is grandfathered in, which is Superstition Stables, she has 8 sites on her 5 acres.He has talked to the neighbors around her and mostly they have no complaints.They like what she had done and how she has improved the facilities.The majority of these facilities are already in developed areas.They have REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 17 OF 30 paved roads around them.The horse people would probably prefer that they not be paved.They are trying to give them the ability to apply for a conditional use permit, which has to go through the complete process.Each facility requesting it would have to show how the facility is set up.Mr. Foster made a comment that he took 2.5 acres and put on it what it basically needed for these facilities and he thought they could have 7 to 10 units.These are limited facilities that would be offered. They keep mentioning trailer parks.Trailer parks offer amenities.The amenities they are offering are equivalent to what these people are offering at their horse boarding facilities:a place for the horse to stay and exercise.You have to have that.The number of horses that you have increases the number of amenities that you have.It takes up more room. He thinks most of the smaller facilities are not set up to have any.Some may come in the future, but they would have to go through the process and the council could put a limitation on the number of horses they could have. Vice Mayor Eck asked what he thought of the development fees. Councilmember Serdy commented he thinks it is a tribute to democracy that we have everyone up here trying to do the right thing in representing everyone in the city, instead of just leaning one way or the other.He thinks they should welcome as many new people and new businesses as they can.The economy is not getting any better and he wants to see more events and more people come as other communities are trying to shoo the horse people out.None of us up here want to discourage them, but he wants to encourage them.He has been on record for being for lower development fees north of Apache Trail.It would be a good example.The roads are already built there.Anything we could do to ease that would be good.We are not going to lose any money, just not make as much if we do not hit them with the larger fees. Councilmember Barker commented in order to do that, to restructure those fees, they would run into a wail.From what she understood from the city attorney, if they dropped them on one group that would be considered similar. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL. SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 18 OF 30 City Attorney Joel Stern stated if they pass this tonight and put a provision in there saying they are exempt from development fees, it could be a legal issue.It probably is not legal; probably an 80% chance it is not legal.The way to fix that is to have the development fee ordinance looked at again by the consultant and have a separate category for that use based on the criteria that they set forth in the ordinance, such as if it will be temporary or year round, for six months, as he has not heard how long this is going to be since they have not passed this.That is what an analyst would look at.How long, the time period for someone to use that space, it also gets into the number of trips that use the road and the other types of development fee services. Probably a study needs to be done on that to know exactly how much it is.In the meantime, if this thing passes with no reference to develop fees, someone may come to the planning and zoning commission and the commission says yes, they get a conditional use permit and this probably catch all phrase in the terms says they must pay any and all applicable fees, and that means development fees.They would have to pay the development fee for the space as determined by Mr. Steinke, and that depends on the site plan presented to the commission.If someone does not like that or a resident does not like it, it could get appealed to the council.There is an appellate provision that would allow due process to continue to the next level.If that is not agreeable, then they would get into the court system. There is a due process system. Councilmember Barker commented there is no legal way to do anything with impact fees within the ordinance as written.They would either have to continue this or vote no on it and ask staff to come back with another proposal. City Attorney Joel Stern stated to get.around the development fee issue that would be correct. Councilmember Serdy commented he went all the way to just waiving the fees.When Brad was introduced, they were told he had discretion.While that does not mean waive ;he can set them wherever he wants according to the impact.He asked if the city_has the discretion to welcome REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER la, 2009 PAGE 19 OF 30 these new enterprises and encourage them rather than hit them full bore and drive them out and keep them out. City Attorney Joel Stern stated Mr. Steinke, as the development services administrator, probably has the discretion to compare the most similar use to this type of use and apply the fee..That is the discretion he has.He does not have the discretion to waive the fee. Councilmember Barker commented he also cannot lower it unless given direction. City Attorney Joel Stern commented or to lower the other comparable use.He is saying between $2,877 up to the worst case scenario of $5,825, it will be somewhere in the middle, depending on the criteria presented on the site plan to the planning and zoning commission.At that point, that is probably what would happen.He believes it would be approved by the commission and it would be appealed, and at one point the applicant would have to pay the fee.The applicant would then go to the counter and Mr. Steinke would have to go through the analysis and determine the fee.There is an appellate procedure there, too. Mayor Insalaco commented these spaces would have to have sewer and water.He asked what it entails as they cannot just park a trailer there.They must have electric and water. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated the ordinance as written has Provision G which reads properly permitted utility hook-ups and/or self-contained RV camping shall be allowed.No onsite dumping of sewage waste shall be allowed unless the boarding facility is connected to the sewer district system or unless other sewage disposal solutions are permitted by Pinal County Health.He corresponded with Mr. Anglin today from the sewer district.They looked at the current sewer line map available.There are currently only 3 horse boarding properties that are within 200' or 300' of the line.They are Superstition Stables 1, Superstition Stables 2 and J&K, the one in the medium density area. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 20 OF 30 Mayor Insalaco asked where they would dump their waste. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated if someone comes forward with a conditional use permit proposal to have RV camping, he believes they would make the decision whether or not they wish to accommodate dry camping, which is where they would not be allowed to dump any sewage or any water on site.They would have to drive to Mesa or where the nearest RV dump is and dispose of their sewage in that manner.If one of these facilities is already hooked up to the sewer, the sewer company stated if dry camping is the solution, they would not require them to hook up to the sewer system.If they do want to hook up their RVs to an existing sewer system, then they would probably be looking at one fee for the whole facility similar to the way they deal with RV parks. Mayor Insalaco commented that it seems like every time an issue comes up, whether it be cargo containers or this or that, you hear the words all the time that we voted you in.There are other people that voted us in, too. And he has people on the other side that have talked to him, so he wonders whose wishes he is to respect.He has to respect everybody's wishes.They are not trying to push out horse people; we are trying to protect horse people.He has had horse people tell him that they do not want these RV campers next to them, so either somebody is telling a fib, or we are not getting around to everybody living all around these people.Some of these parks have 25 people within the area.He asked if they talked to all of these people to get their permission or get their blessing.There are 38,000 people that live here, but not all of them vote.He has more people that voted for him that are telling him no, so he has to go with the wishes of the people that put him in office.He is speaking for himself, but going along with Councilmember Coleman who has been here a lot longer than most of us, he knows what they have done in the past to protect this horse property and low density.That is all they are doing.It is a bald faced lie for anyone to say they are trying to push out the horse people.It is not true.They are trying to protect this area.He stated if there was no more discussion he would then call for a motion. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 21 OF 30 Councilmember Wilson MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO. 1345 BE READ BY TITLE ONLY AND THE READING OF THE ENTIRE ORDINANCE BE WAIVED. Councilmember Barker SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly read the ordinance by title only. Councilmember Wilson MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO.1345, AS READ BY THE CITY CLERK, BE APPROVED AND ADOPTED WITH THE FOLLOWING AMENDMENTS:THAT CAMPING BE PERMITTED ON HORSE BOARDING FACILITIES OF 5 ACRES OR MORE AND A LIMIT OF NO MORE THAN 10 PER 5 ACRES WITH APPROVAL FROM THE PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT. Councilmember Serdy SECONDED THE MOTION. Councilmember Coleman asked if the development fees would be assessed since they were not mentioned. City Attorney Joel Stern stated that is correct. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly asked if the comment on it going to planning and zoning would mean the conditional use permit process. Councilmember Wilson stated that is correct. Vice Mayor Eck requested the motion be read again. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly stated it is to adopt the ordinance with the following changes: REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 22 OF 30 that the horse boarding facilities be allowed to have the RV camping on parcels of 5 acres or More, that there be a limit of no more than 10 units, and that the process be as outlined in the ordinance, the conditional use permit process. Vice Mayor Eck asked if they would be doing a conditional use permit on each one. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly stated the property owner would have to go through a conditional use permit process if they wish to have these rights. Vice Mayor Eck commented the development fees would be the same. City Clerk Kathleen Connelly stated they would be as from the discussion tonight. VOTE:3-4 (Councilmembers Barker, Dietz and Coleman and Mayor Insalaco voted in opposition.) Councilmember Barker stated she needed to explain her vote.She is all for this enterprise, but she is not for increasing the density.By putting 10 as the minimum, they have increased the density in that zone.She has to vote no, she has no choice. The motion failed. Councilmember Wilson asked if he could do another motion. Councilmember Coleman requested additional discussion before a new motion was made. He asked Councilmember Barker if she would be okay with it if it was limited to the number of RVs. Councilmember Barker stated if it was limited to. that which zoning calls for, the density of the zoning, but she would exclude the permanent residence from that density.She .would exclude their home.If they have 5 acres, they could.have 5 RVs parked at their ranch. REGULAR MEETING OF THE -.CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 23 OF 30 Vice Mayor Eck commented that means that the current one that is legal is already at their maximum. Councilmember Barker commented she is grandfathered. Vice Mayor Eck commented she is grandfathered, but there is only a little space taken up out of this much space. Councilmember Barker stated it is a low density area and she wants it to remain low density. Vice Mayor Eck commented it is an extremely low density area.The 8 RVs are not even as big as one house. Councilmember Barker reiterated she wants to keep it at the density of the zoning. She asked why they should have the zoning there if they are just going to ignore the density.It seems silly.We said we wanted low density in that area, so why not use low density. Vice Mayor Eck commented they could vote yes on it, but it is not going to change anything. Councilmember Coleman commented he believes he has been the hard guy here.He thinks he could go .for that, .even though he thinks 5 acres is too small for a commercial boarding area, at least comparing it to others. He did go out -and visit Hansen's place.It was very nice and clean.He thinks she is using 5 acres now for that, and he thinks he could go for the way that Councilmember Barker said. City Attorney Joel Stern requested Rudy explain the density of the rural areas. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated the general plan defines low density as zero to one dwelling unit per acre.The reason it says zero to one is because we have very few properties that are actually one acre. Most of our properties are 1.25 acres gross or 2.5 acres and so REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 24 OF 30 on in the rural areas.A motion that supports one unit per one acre would be consistent with the general plan designation in a low density area. City Attorney Joel Stern stated they are looking at whole numbers because they cannot cut an RV in half.In looking at the map that he passed out, he asked how the density would be on most of those 5 acre parcels. Councilmember Barker stated there are 7 of them. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated all of the properties that on the map that we showed yesterday are in low density areas according to the general plan except for one. Councilmember Dietz commented he counted nine 2.5 acres, seven 5 acres and one 4 acre property. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated 6 of those 5 acre properties could potentially have RVs on them. City Manager George Hoffman stated he described zero to one as being consistent with the general plan.Actually, Councilmember Barker's plan is one per acre plus the main house.He asked if that would be two. Councilmember Barker stated it is actually one -and -a -fifth. Vice Mayor Eck stated it is no different than the caretaker residence. City Attorney Joel Stern asked what if there is a guest house. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated the council had approved a guest unit ordinance.The caretaker residence is temporary, so he is not sure they could include that, but they do have an ordinance that says every REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 25 OF 30 residential property in the city shall have a guest unit if they want to.He asked if the gue -E unit or main residence should be counted toward the density. Vice Mayor Eck commented he was just comparing it to what they already have, which is one unit and one caretaker's unit, if you want to look at density. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated he is correct.Horse boarding properties are allowed to have one seasonal/farm labor residence.It would have to be counted towards the maximum count. City Attorney Joel Stern asked for clarification that it would be counted. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated the cleanest way would be if it is 5 acres they can have 5 units.One of them could be the caretaker's unit and one could be the main residence. Councilmember Barker commented she would still like to exclude the main residence. are excluding the main residence. Vice Mayor Eck stated they Mayor Insalaco agreed. Councilmember Barker asked if they are excluding the main residence from the calculation. Councilmember Coleman stated they are not.It is 5 units on 5 acres. Councilmember Barker commented it if does go, it is to exclude it. Senior Planner Rudy Esquivias stated the definition in its plainest form would include the residence. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 26 OF 30 Councilmember Barker commented unless they make the motion to specify otherwise. City Attorney Joel Stern stated that is correct. Councilmember Barker stated it can be included in the motion that the main residence is not counted in that ratio. City Manager George Hoffman commented Rudy is talking general plan and she is talking the ordinance. Councilmember Barker stated that is true. There was general discussion on how it would be put into the ordinance and that everything but the main residence would be included as one of the 5 units, even a guest house or caretaker's residence. Councilmember Wilson MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO. 1345, AS READ BY THE CITY CLERK, BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING AMENDMENTS:THAT CAMPING BE PERMITTED ON HORSE BOARDING FACILITIES OF 5 ACRES OR MORE, AND THAT THE NUMBER OF CAMPING SITES BE LIMITED TO ONE UNIT PER ACRE PLUS THE MAIN RESIDENCE. Vice Mayor Eck SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:6-1 (Councilmember Dietz voted in opposition.) Councilmember Coleman commented this is probably, in his mind, the biggest compromise he has made up here. The motion carried. OLD BUSINESS None. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 27 OF 30 NEW BUSINESS None. COUNCIL DIRECTION TO STAFF SCHEDULE FOR BOARD AND COMMISSION APPOINTMENTS/REAPPOINTMENTS )City Clerk Kathleen Connelly briefed the council on the item. Mayor Insalaco called for a motion. Councilmember Barker MOVED THAT THE FOLLOWING DIRECTION BE GIVEN TO STAFF REGARDING SCHEDULE FOR BOARD AND COMMISSION APPOINTMENTS AND REAPPOINTMENTS:THAT INTERVIEWS FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, CONSTRUCTION CODE BOARD OF APPEALS, HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES COMISSION, AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY BE DONE ON MONDAY OCTOBER 5, 2009, WITH THESE APPOINTMENTS BEING MADE ON TUESDAY, OCTOBER 6, 2009; AND THAT INTERVIEWS FOR THE.,LIBRARY BOARD, MUNICIPAL PROPERTY CORPORATION, PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION AND PLANNING AND 'ZONING COMMISSION BE DONE ON MONDAY, OCTOBER 19, 2009 WITH THESE APPOINTMENTS BEING MADE ON TUESDAY, OCTOBER 20, 2009. Councilmember Dietz SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. SELECTION OF MEETING DATES, TIMES, LOCATIONS, AND PURPOSES Councilmember Dietz MOVED THAT AN EXECUTIVE SESSION AT 5:45 P.M. AND A WORK SESSION AT 7:00 P.M.BE HELD ON MONDAY, OCTOBER 5, 2009, IN THE CITY COUNCIL CONFERENCE ROOM AND CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS, RESPECTIVELY; AND REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 28 OF 30 THAT AN EXECUTIVE SESSION AT 5:45 P.M. BE HELD ON TUESDAY, OCTOBER 6, 2009, IN THE CITY COUNCIL CONFERENCE ROOM. Councilmember Barker SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. CALL TO THE PUBLIC: Mr. Noel Benoist, 900 N. San Marcos #79, Apache Junction, addressed the council to suggest that the gateway to the city be moved from Apache Trail and Meridian to Idaho and the freeway area to prevent a multijurisdictional area. Vice Mayor Eck commented when they come across the freeway with 80,000 vehicles a day and they cross Meridian Road, he would like to see a gateway monument welcoming people into Apache Junction.That is the only time he has ever heard of a gateway being mentioned. ADJOURNMENT )Mayor Insalaco adjourned the meeting at 8:56 p.m. Consent Agenda Items are as follows: 1. Acceptance of Agenda. 2. Acceptance of Minutes of Regular Meeting of August 18, 2009. 3. Consideration of approval of first amendment to -Superstition Vistas Area Study Financial.Participation Agreement with East Valley Partnership. ACCEPTED THIS 6TH DAY OF OCTOBER, 2009, BY THE MAYOR AND CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF APACHE JUNCTION, ARIZONA. SIGNED AND ATTESTED TO THIS 6TH DAY OF OCTOBER, 2009. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 ,PAGE 29 OF 30 ATTEST: KATHLEEN CONNELLY City Clerk UOUN S. INSALACO ayor CITY COUNCIL MINUTES CERTIFICATION I hereby certify that the foregoing minutes are a true and correct copy of the minutes of the regular meeting of the City Council of the City of Apache Junction, Arizona, held on the 15th day of September, 2009.I further certify that the meeting was duly called and held and that a quorum was present. Dated this 29th of September, 2009. 0 KATHLEEN CONNELLY City Clerk REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL SEPTEMBER 15, 2009 PAGE 30 OF 30