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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1997-11-18 City Council Regular MinutesCITY COUNCIL REGULAR MEETING NOVEMBER 18,1997 The regular meeting of the City Council of the City of Apache Junction, Arizona,was held on November 18,1997,at the Apache Junction City Council Chambers pursuant to the notice required by law. CALL TO ORDER Mayor Coleman called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. INVOCATION Councilmember Durbala gave the Invocation. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE Councilmember Insalaco led the Pledge of Allegiance. ROLL CALL Councilmembers Present:Mayor Coleman Vice Mayor Surra Councilmember Eck Councilmember Urich Councilmember Insalaco Councilmember McClain Councilmember Durbala Staff Present: Others Present: City Manager Curtis Shook Asst.City Manager George Hoffman City Clerk Kathleen Connelly City Attorney Joel Stern City Engineer Gordon Grandy Public Works Director Doug Dobson Development Services Director Larry Harmer ACCEPTANCE OF CONSENT AGENDA )Vice Mayor Surra MOVED THAT THE CONSENT AGENDA BE ACCEPTED AS PRESENTED;AND THAT WE RECOGNIZE THE OUTSTANDING SERVICE TO THE COMMUNITY BY THE FOLLOWING CITY EMPLOYEE:PARKS WORKER I KEITH GRAVES;AND THAT THE INTERGOVERNMENTAL AGENCY AGREEMENT WITH THE APACHE JUNCTION UNIFIED SCHOOL DISTRICT TO RENEW THE SCHOOL SAFETY PROGRAM BE APPROVED AND THAT THE MAYOR BE AUTHORIZED TO SIGN THE AGREEMENT;AND THAT REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 1 OF 24 APPROVAL AND RATIFICATION BE GIVEN TO PURCHASE OF SHOTCRETE CHANNEL LINING FROM M & S SHOTCRETE IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $11,245.92. Councilmember Urich SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. AWARDS,PRESENTATIONS AND COMMUNICATIONS None. CALL TO THE PUBLIC Ms Sherral A.Ventura,201 E.Southern Avenue #213,Apache Junction,read a letter representing the Pueblo homeowners regarding adding on structures to recreational vehicles,travel trailers and park models in parks.It stated owners hope to extend their living quarters by stand alone,habitable additions to those affixed to their park models.The building would be limited to the size of the lot,excluding easement and adhering to the building code and ordinances.They would like to be treated with equal opportunities as others are who do not reside in the park,especially when it comes to living space and living conditions. Ms.Carol Schmidt,200 E.Southern Avenue #27,Apache Junction,addressed the council regarding structures in recreational vehicle parks.She had started with just a park model,staying only a few months.They are now staying here eight months and they would like to have more living space to spend their full time here,but they need additional space for their crafts. Mrs.Midge Conway,902 S.Ocotillo,Apache Junction,addressed the council regarding design review.The City of Chandler is now doing design review to keep the houses from looking alike,and added that Chandler is now listed as one of the top ten cities in the country for growth and quality.She distributed the article to the council and requested they take this into consideration. Mary C.Walsh,200 E.Southern Avenue #6,Apache Junction,the president of the board of directors for the Superstition Mountain Resort Homeowners Association,addressed the council regarding habitable space,or "arizona" rooms,in the parks.She gave the council the design guidelines for her association.She stated they are detailed,including "arizona rooms", requirements for permits,city and building codes,size limitations and easement restrictions.She added those residences that already have "arizona rooms" would have an advantage in the resale market over those that would be REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 2 OF 24 prohibited from having them.She urged them not to put any restrictions on how the living space in these room would be utilized. Ms Rosalie Gifford,201 E.Southern Avenue #28,Apache Junction,addressed the council regarding tagging or spraypainting of signs in the city.She wanted to know what is being done to clean up the city,and volunteered to help clean it up. CITY MANAGER'S REPORT City Manager Curtis Shook thanked the News and the Independent for their articles on the Apache Junction Open House that will be held on November 25 from 5:30 to 7:00 p.m.at the City Conference Center.It will give citizens an opportunity to ask questions of the general plan process or find out how to get involved in that process.He described how it would involve land use, transportation,open space,recreation,economic development,housing,capital facilities and natural resources.The general plan will be a map for the city to follow for the next 5 to 10 years.He encouraged all members of the community to attend. PUBLIC HEARINGS PROPOSED ORDINANCE NO.1012/REZONING REQUEST BY RICHARD & LORIN BERRY )Development Services Director Larry Harmer briefed the council on the item.This is for 2 half -acre lots located in the southwest corner of E.Broadway and S.Vista.They are vacant and they are requesting to rezone from CR-5 multi -family to CR-1MH conventional single family manufactured home on a 20,000 sq.ft.lot.The lots meet the minimum standards for the classification.The planning and zoning commission recommended approval with a vote of 6-1,with stipulations.The stipulations deal with the dedication of rights -of -way and impact fee assessment at the time of installation of the homes. anything to the briefing. questions by the council. The applicant declined to add Mayor Coleman opened the item to Councilmember Urich verified that i t is on the southwest corner rather than the southeast corner,as the agenda said one thing and the paperwork something else. Councilmember McClain asked if these lots,since they are on corners,are supposed to be a net 20,000 sq.ft. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 3 OF 24 Harmer stated there had not 'Harmer stated could do with Harmer stated Development Services Director Larry that is not the way the land development code is written. Councilmember McClain asked why been a work session on this rezoning. Development Services Director Larry there was no specific reason. Councilmember McClain asked what he the two lots if the zoning did not change. Development Services Director Larry they meet the minimum lot size for multi -family,like a duplex. Councilmember McClain asked if he could put a duplex on each lot. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he could.He believes to the owner wants to use the lots for manufactured housing.He added in most of their calculations,the usable area is calculated on gross acreage. Councilmember McClain added she seemed to recall that Rudy Esquivias in the past has stated when two corners come together,there has to be a larger lot. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he was unaware of those circumstances. Councilmember McClain stated she was concerned if this was rezoned and then the owner found out he could not do what he intended to do. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated the calculations were done prior to this going to the planning and zoning commission to assure the minimum qualifications were met. Mayor Coleman opened the public hearing on the item.There being no one wishing to speak,he closed the public hearing and reopened the item to council discussion. could be built on this property. Councilmember Eck asked if duplexes Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated that is based on the exising zoning.He added in response to Councilmember McClain's earlier question that the net figure of square footage REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 4 OF 24 required on a corner lot is approximately 12,000.Both lots meet the minimum figure. Councilmember McClain stated she had thought it was a lot larger. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated there are many locations around town where the remaining property is substantially smaller than the minimum gross requirement,and they are still legal lots. Councilmember McClain stated the lots do not look very big.She asked if staff had any concerns about the duplexes creating ingress/egress problems. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they would not have had a problem as they have their own street frontage. Councilmember McClain asked if there would be set back problems. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they meet the minimum qualifications. Mayor Coleman closed the discussion and called for a motion. Councilmember Urich MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO.1012 BE READ BY TITLE ONLY AND THE READING OF THE ENTIRE ORDINANCE BE WAIVED. Councilmember Eck SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. City Clerk Kathy Connelly read Ordinance No.1012 by title only. Councilmember Urich MOVED THAT ORDINANCE NO.1012,AS READ BY THE CITY CLERK,BE APPROVED AND ADOPTED. Councilmember Insalaco SECONDED THE MOTION. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 5 OF 24 VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. OLD BUSINESS. None. NEW BUSINESS. AUTHORIZATION FOR CITY MANAGER TO APPROVE SRP UNDERGROUND EASEMENTS )City Manager Curtis Shook stated these are easements required by Salt River Project to deliver power to the cell sites on city property at two locations.The first is for US West at the public works grounds,and the other is the Nextel site on the city hall grounds.He introduced Donley Hurd,the management information specialist, who worked with SRP,the phone and cable lines to create something orderly. Management Information Systems Supervisor Donley Hurd requested council to grant authorization to the city manager to sign the SRP easements.The cellular vendors had wanted to use the power provided by the city from our existing lines,and they have been requested to have their own power and meters from SRP.SRP needs the easements to supply that power to them. Mayor Coleman opened the discussion by council.There being no discussion,he called for a motion. Vice Mayor Surra MOVED THAT AUTHORIZATION FOR THE CITY MANAGER TO SIGN DOCUMENTS PERMITTING SALT RIVER PROJECT-,OTHERWISE KNOWN AS SRP,TO PROVIDE POWER TO TWO CELLULAR SITES,ONE LOCATED AT 725 EAST BASELINE ROAD AND ONE AT 1001 NORTH IDAHO ROAD,BE APPROVED. Councilmember Insalaco SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. COUNCIL DIRECTION TO STAFF ON PROPOSED LEGISLATION OR ACTION STRUCTURES IN RECREATIONAL VEHICLE/ TRAVEL TRAILER DEVELOPMENTS direction to staff should be to come back agreements with,bring those back and ask REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 6 OF 24 )Councilmember Durbala stated the with the five areas that they had the staff to come back with something more detailed on the sizes,where it is available,and the planned development on the recreational vehicle lots. Vice Mayor Surra suggested having a status summary paper provided to them including what is in the present code and what is working now in parks that have them. Councilmember Durbala stated they have two parks that have given them their information tonight. Vice Mayor Surra stated those side by side would help to make things more clear cut.It gives direction for information.She would like to see a level playing field in whatever is prepared,whether it is a renter or an owner.She believes the same standards should apply to site built homes as to manufactured homes. Mayor Coleman agreed with Vice Mayor Surra. Councilmember Durbala stated he would not like to see any cooking facilities in the "arizona rooms". Vice Mayor Surra disagreed with Councilmember Durbala.She does not want the council to determine what the use needs to be.If it meets code for whatever use they build it,that should be the determining factor.She used as an example when she added on to her own home,she did not have to tell them what use the addition was going to be for when she applied for the permit.Everything was inspected to make sure it was up to code during the construction.They should have the right to use the building as they want. Councilmember Eck agreed with Vice Mayor Surra.He believes they should be able to build and improve their quality of life.He just wants them to have a city building permit for what is constructed,no matter where in the city it is constructed,and that it is inspected by a city inspector to assure the appropriate work is done. Councilmember Urich stated she does not want to see discrimination between rental parks and owner -owned parks. She also does not want to restrict the size of the "arizona rooms". Vice Mayor Surra stated the size of the lot should restrict the size of the room. Councilmember Urich agreed. Councilmember McClain stated they should be able to enjoy their life and home and use the space as they need. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 7 OF 24 Her biggest concern is that they do not get too close to the neighboring property.They should have at least 3'between them and not have awnings hanging to close in case of fires.She believes as long as this is observed and everything is up to code that they should be in good shape. Councilmember Durbala stated the two .homeowners associations who brought their bylaws in tonight do have regulations on these structures.He added this is why he had asked the five parks who have those agreements to bring them in for the discussion. Everything that has been discussed was reviewed last night and is in those two bylaws.Some do not prefer to have cooking areas,others allow cooking areas. Vice Mayor Surra stated homeowners associations for those areas can have stricter regulations than the city code for those areas.She does not believe cooking areas should be put into the city code;that should be reserved for the individual park,in which the individual homeowners have a vote.They do not have to buy or rent in there if they do not like the restrictions. Councilmember Insalaco stated if the rooms are built to code,i t should not matter whether a hot plate is in that room or their park model. Vice Mayor Surra added they would know if when they went to purchase or rent in that park if that is a homeowner regulation,but they may not know if it is a city ordinance.She thinks that would be an unfair place to put it. Mayor Coleman closed the discussion and called for a motion. Vice Mayor Surra MOVED THAT STAFF PREPARE FOR COUNCIL AT THE EARLIEST CONVENIENCE A REQUIREMENT,A STATUS PAPER THAT GIVES COUNCIL THE REQUIREMENTS COUNCIL HAS BEEN DISCUSSING IN BOTH LAST NIGHT'S AND TONIGHT'S DISCUSSION REGARDING THE ADDITION OF STRUCTURES TO ANY OF OUR PARK RESIDENCES THAT REFLECTS A BASIC CITY CODE REQUIREMENTS THAT ADDRESSES SET BACKS AND THE AMOUNT OF LOT AREA THAT CAN BE TAKEN UP,BUT NOTHING REGARDING THE USE OF THE ROOM. City Clerk Kathy Connelly asked if permitting requirements needed to be mentioned. Vice Mayor Surra stated she believed that already was a requirement in city code.She added the status paper should show them what is allowed and currently under consideration. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 8 OF 24 Mayor Coleman asked if that report would include the minutes of when those agreements were adopted.He believes that would be helpful to him. would be things in general. City Clerk Kathy Connelly stated it Councilmember Durbala SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. TRASH PICK UP SERVICE WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS )Councilmember Durbala stated he had received a number of complaints from residents.He commented that some of the ideas from the public do not appear to be favorable with the other members of the council.He added he would agree with what the other members requested last night,and if that does not work,later on he will try something else. Councilmember Durbala MOVED TO DIRECT STAFF TO GO WITH THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE COUNCIL LAST NIGHT AND WHAT THE CITY MANAGER HAD WITH THE MEETING WITH THE TRASH HAULERS OF POSSIBLY GOING TO TWO -DAY -A -WEEK PICK UP,GUARANTEEING THE 90 GALLON CONTAINERS,AND TWO OTHER THINGS THAT THE CITY MANAGER WAS AWARE OF.He requested the city manager to emphasize those items before the whole motion was put together. City Manager Curtis Shook stated the points discussed were that all residential pick up would be on two designated days of the week,which would be Monday and Thursday,between the hours of 6 a.m.and 5 p.m.;there would be a standardization of waste containers, preferabley a 90 gallon container;that street collection points would be regulated;that vehicle maintenance requirements would be stated with possible annual inspection of vehicles;and that there would be a structure of fines assessed to haulers for non-compliance with these collection regulations.I t was to be brought back to council in the near future as an amendment.It was to be done as a midway procedure to see if it could alleviate the concerns of the council regarding noise,pollution and days of collection,among others. City Attorney Joel Stern stated he heard no mention of a mandatory pick up.He questioned whether that was also the desire. Vice Mayor Surra stated that was one of the things they really did not want to put into it. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 9 OF 24 City Attorney Joel Stern commented he just wanted to make sure it was not part of the motion. Vice Mayor Surra verified that it was not part of the motion. Mayor Coleman wanted to know if it was state law that there be garbage pick up twice a week,what happens if they miss a day due to it being on a holiday. City Clerk Kathy Connelly stated she was unable to get an answer from anyone on that. City Manager Curtis Shook stated there will be a meeting with the haulers in early December over these proposed changes requested by council.He will find an answer to that question then, so that the final amendment for public hearing would be included in the final recommendation. City Attorney stated while garbage pick up is required twice weekly by state law,he is unaware of who monitors the pick up. Councilmember Durbala added he would like to see a time restriction on how long garbage cans could remain on the street on the pick up day or afterwards.He suggested they should be off the street by 5:30 p.m. It was brought up by a number of councilmembers that there are people who do not get home until well after that time. Councilmember Urich wanted it clarified that the pick up is concerning individual residences. City Manager Curtis Shook stated that was correct.It does not change commercial or park pick ups. City Clerk Kathy Connelly stated Michael Munroe may have information on what other cities require as far as taking a container back off the street. Councilmember Durbala stated he would not like to see it there for 3 or 4 days. Vice Mayor Surra commented this issue was regarding collection,not putting back the garbage cans. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 10 OF 24 the motion. MOTION. the motion. motion be read back to him. Mayor Coleman called for a second on Councilmember McClain SECONDED THE Mayor Coleman called for a vote on Councilmember Durbala asked that his City Clerk Kathy Connelly read THAT THE MOTION INCLUDED THE TWO TIME PER WEEK PICK UP ON MONDAYS AND THURSDAYS; THE 90 GALLON STANDARDIZED CONTAINERS;THE VEHICLE MAINTENANCE;WITH POSSIBLE INSPECTION ONE TIME PER YEAR;AND FINES FOR NON-COMPLIANCE. Vice Mayor Surra added it should include street regulations for sites and also the time frame of between 6 a.m. and 5 p.m. City Clerk Kathy Connelly stated that was already in there. Mayor Coleman asked for a vote on the motion. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. Vice Mayor Surra stated there are some pick ups that are allowing some people to put their cans in a separate bag attached to their trash container.Those cans are donated to organizations to use as fundraisers.She encouraged everyone to do that,as it is a way of recycling painlessly and it helps non-profit organizations. USE OF CARGO CONTAINERS WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS )Councilmember Durbala stated there have been a number of problems when cargo containers have been asked to be removed from properties under the regulations.He was asked by Park N'Swap if anything could be done.He believes the city should either enforce what they have or change it.He suggested going strictly industrial or commercial with a minimum number of acres,and it would all have to be screened with landscaping,possibly as large as 25 acres.He is aware some of the council would like to see it on smaller areas,where others would not like to see it at all. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 11 OF 24 Mayor Coleman opened the discussion by council. Councilmember McClain stated she could not see restricting it to just large parcels.It apparently has not been restricted,as she has seen a business in the "Y"that has them as their ' offices,and there are others around the city for offices or extra space.She inquired why some should be able to use them,but the small businesses that could really use them could not.They are sturdier than sheds,and at Park N'Swap she believes twenty of the cargo containers would look better then twenty different sheds built.She believes they should be more fair or equitable. Councilmember Urich stated she would like to see the present ordinance remain on the books.She believes it should be enforced if they are starting to appear. Councilmember Eck commented he thought the acreage idea was good to begin with,but now he thinks i t is discriminatory to the small businesses.If it is allowed,it should be allowed everywhere with some type of landscaping regulations. Councilmember McClain stated people should not be allowed to get them and just use them on their property;there should be some type of regulations. Vice Mayor Surra stated they have not been allowing it;they have been illegally using them.The ordinance does not allow them. Councilmember McClain stated it has 'been reported that they are here and there but nothing is being done about it. As a city,she stated i t is being allowed. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he knows of three examples,and one of them is in a court trial the day after tomorrow. Councilmember McClain asked which one that was. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated it is the one being used for offices.He added K Mart has been cited for it,they have removed them the majority of them.One they brought back in and the citation has been reissued on that one.He is not familiar with the other location referred to.He stated his department does go after them and a lot of them have been removed.The ones that have not been removed are being cited. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 12 OF 24 Councilmember McClain stated she has seen two of them being used for offices. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated i t is the one on Old West Highway.He is unaware of any others, if there are some they should be getting cited,too.The one on Ironwood that , is being used as a sales office is also under citation. Councilmember Urich stated the city is trying to clean up its image and she cannot see how allowing these cargo containers in the city is improving it. Councilmember McClain stated she thought it would be more attractive for the individual vendors at the swap meet to have the cargo containers than to have individual sheds. Councilmember Insalaco stated they would be more uniform. Councilmember McClain added they would all look alike,being the same size and more secure. Mayor Coleman stated a previous council saw there was a problem and addressed it.He did not think it was an easy decision for them.He is not sure he wants to take a step back.There is a reason i t is the way it is.He understands that circumstances change but he is not sure this is something he would like to open up again.He is sure that if allowed,it would be more than one or two businesses that would have them. Vice Mayor Surra asked that if these cargo containers were allowed anywhere in the city,what would stop someone in a residential area from putting one in for something.She does not believe they would feel it would be an upgrade to the quality of life if the people in the recreational vehicle parks had decided to use these for their accessory buildings.It would not have been allowed.They are trying to upgrade the appearance of the city,and allowing cargo containers will not do that.She commented it could lead to no structures being built,business would be done from these,and she believes it would be a huge step back in the development of the community.She cannot support changing the ordinance to allow the cargo containers. Councilmembers McClain stated she could not see them being out where they are exposed.The ones she has seen are along the roadway. Vice Mayor Surra added they are against the code and the city is pursuing them. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 13 OF 24 Councilmember McClain commented there are residents that are business people who have asked for them and are told no,yet they see them in the city year after year.The ordinance needs to be either enforced or change it. enforcing them. are enforcing them years later. Councilmember Urich stated they are Councilmember McClain stated they Councilmember Durbala stated he wants to see them on 25 acres or larger and only on a commercial or industrial site.It is not meant for the home or small businesses.It should be totally screened in as designated by Ordinance No.940.In the case of the swap meet, they would have to have the whole thing blocked or walled in. Vice Mayor Surra stated they have not improved that property in 40 years,and they have built permanent structures in the other area that they own. Councilmember Durbala stated they are getting away from what they are talking about. Vice Mayor Surra did not think so. Councilmember Durbala stated he is talking about industrial and commercial,not one business as she is.He used them as an example,and believes the full extent of Ordinance No.940 should be used.He reiterated this would not be for small businesses for storage space.He commented it is not the intent of the ordinance. Vice Mayor Surra asked what ordinance he was talking about. Councilmember Durbala stated the one on the books states no cargo containers.Some of the businesses have put them on,had to take them off,and are now asking the city to do something about them.They have suggested a new ordinance with some changes.This is not saying anything will be done one way or the other;this is to give direction to staff only to either come up with some other proposals or to take no action. Councilmember Eck stated believes they are talking about the swap meet only when it has to be 25 acres or more. It should either be all of them or none of them. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 14 OF 24 Councilmember Durbala stated this would be their opportunity to vote it down and go back to the same one that they have. Councilmember Urich commented that business has been there for 40 years,and the present ordinance has been in the books since 1988. Mayor Coleman closed the discussion and called for a motion. Vice Mayor Surra MOVED THAT THE FOLLOWING DIRECTION BE GIVEN TO STAFF REGARDING THE USE OF CARGO CONTAINERS WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS:THAT WE GO FOR STRICT ENFORCEMENT OF THE ORDINANCE THAT IS ON THE BOOKS. Councilmember Urich SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:4-3 (Councilmembers Insalaco,Eck and Durbala voted in opposition.) The motion carried. Mayor Coleman called for a fifteen minute break. Mayor Coleman reconvened the meeting. AMENDING CITY ZONING REGULATIONS WITH -REGARD TO LOT SIZE REQUIREMENTS IN RESIDENTIAL ZONES )Councilmember McClain stated several options had been discussed at the retreat and she requested Mr.Harmer to brief the council on them. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated a number of possibilities had been discussed. Councilmember Eck stated one of their priorities is to get the minimum lot size up as soon as possible. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated there is a minumum lot size to every classification.They would have to sit down and show council how they compare to each other,and if one is adjusted,the possibility of several others having to be adjusted. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 15 OF 24 Councilmember Eck asked if the several meant all the different zonings. Development Services Director Larry Harmer said that was possible.They may choose not to,but they should be considered during the process. Councilmember McClain commented she thought more direction had been established at the retreat that would have staff coming back to them with more ideas. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated these are just some of the different things they would be presenting to them. Councilmember McClain stated they had been talking about a new designation with a lot size requiring a minimum of 9,000 sq.ft. Vice Mayor Surra asked if that was for land not currently zoned. Councilmember McClain stated they are not rezoning anything.They are trying to set up a new designation for someone trying to rezone their property going to 9,000 sq.ft.and possibly working down from there with planned development designation. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they are working on scenarios to bring back to council. Councilmember McClain asked when they would have those. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they would have to be reviewed by legal counsel before they could be brought before council. City Manager Curtis Shook suggested having a work session in January to preview these ideas. Councilmember McClain stated they started in April and determined that something needed to be done about the planned developments coming in and giving nothing back to the city.Nothing was done after that.They then had a meeting in August and still nothing has happened.She asked how much longer they would have to wait.She commented most of the land is already used up and they already have way more little lots than they need.She thought there would be something pretty valid by now. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 16 OF 24 Mayor Coleman stated most of the land has not been used up,especially considering the future growth. Councilmember McClain stated there is not a whole lot of land left in the city now.She believes they need to change this. Councilmember Eck asked if they could use what they have currently to control the developments until January. Councilmember McClain stated they could tell developers bringing in a planned development to not expect the city to give it away.But she cautioned they do need to set up a new designation. She asked how this could be done. Vice Mayor Surra asked if when they set up a new classification,did it have to be attached to a new area that already exists or could someone choose to rezone for land they currently have. There was discussion between council and Development Services Director Larry Harmer on how the new classification could be applied and the steps the developer would have to take for a planned development versus hard zoning. City Manager Curtis Shook asked if they were talking about two distinct things;one being the current planned development ordinance involving trade-offs and the other regarding the C-3 which would create a larger minimum lot size and allow the developer to do a planned development out of the C-3.He suggested that during the interim,i f council does not want to go through planned development,they should stay at a hard zone. Councilmember McClain commented that they could also bring them something beautiful. Councilmember Eck clarified that they would be doing something on a 9,000 sq.ft.planned development so that they could trade off to about 7,000 sq.ft.He asked why they would not just stay with hard zoning. Councilmember Insalaco stated he believed they are talking about bringing the hard zoning up to 9,000. City Manager Curtis Shook stated they are talking about two things.One is that they allow for planned developments,and that an ordinance be devised that sets out different types of trade offs that the council can consider when someone brings in a planned development concept.Council can decide to accept the trade offs and design REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 17 OF 24 for that property.Secondly,the hard zoning in a C-3 zone be changed to 9,000 so that land subdivided in the future would be under that minimum. Mayor Coleman stated he wanted to see something that encourages something other than starter homes. Councilmember McClain stated other cities are up to 10,000 sq.ft. Mayor Coleman stated there are some areas by the freeway that call for a higher density use and other areas that call for something less than that.He wants to see something fairly comprehensive. Councilmember McClain stated they should be apprehensive that the city will demand more when they bring in their plans. Vice Mayor Surra stated even now they still have to vote for it;if you do not like it,vote against it.You have to take a hard stand until what you want is on the books. Mayor Coleman added they are also looking at the quality. Councilmember Durbala stated he does not believe they have to rewrite the whole ordinance right away.They can use other avenues such as the final vote,asking staff to make sure the garages are on the side,different set backs,and widening the lots.He thinks this can be done at the 7,000 sq.ft.level.He also suggested looking at the percentages of larger lots to smaller lots.He believes everything was just under discussion at earlier retreats and nothing was voted on,or it would have been illegal. City Attorney Joel Stern stated there had been no voting sessions,but today is.This is concerning policy issues,not legal issues.They can decide how they want the zoning or the planned development.Currently,if you do not like what is proposed,you can just vote no.He suggested making a motion to either take no action or to take some kind of action and come up with a proposal. City Manager Curtis Shook suggested going back to Larry for the moment. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated had a generalized list of options from the retreat and he is trying to look at a time frame in order to give them the most comprehensive package. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 18 OF 24 City Manager Curtis Shook stated there is only one meeting in December and he is concerned about whether they could be given what they are looking for within that time frame. Councilmember McClain suggested staff tell the developers where council is coming from.Council is tired of hearing of how much money and time has been spent by these developers.This is why she suggested the new ordinance that the staff could quote.It might help the developers spend their money more wisely. Councilmember Insalaco stated not everybody likes a big back yard.He preferred seeing some of the length taken off the lot size and added to the width,spreading the houses out. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated a lot of good points have been made.They have been trying to give the developers guidance,but they do not want to do what council would like to see.They will now have something to tell the developers that this is what the council demands,and if it is not to council standards,then staff will deny the plans. Vice Mayor Surra asked why everything had to go to planning and zoning. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they do not send it there.They make their application and they have the right to have it seen. Vice Mayor Surra asked why a date is set for planning and zoning if you know if will not pass. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they have paid their money and they have the right.Once the money is paid,they are on the clock.If they have not met the standards, they can reject them. Vice Mayor Surra asked what was needed for them to not be able to send it to planning and zoning. Councilmember McClain stated that would take changing the standards. Vice Mayor Surra stated they should give them a list of standards for council to put their stamp of approval on. Councilmember Durbala stated they should change the front set backs,make the garages a little off to the side, REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 19 OF 24 widen the lots;that is what he would like to see.If he has something to start with,he does not have to go through the whole process again. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated the more things that are in written form,the more teeth they have up front during the early part of the process.They could give them further guidance during the presubmittal meeting. Vice Mayor Surra added they do not seem to follow the suggestions that staff has given them. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they counterargue that this is what the market is at this time. He added the development criteria can be put together easily without being in ordinance form.They can tell the developers that this is what the council is looking for,and if they bring something other than that in,their chances of denial would be good.Since it would not be an ordinance,this would leave council with some flexibility. Vice Mayor Surra added that planning and zoning would be able to say that it is not on the list of standards and they can recommend denial.The developer could then appeal it,but they would have already been given the information on what was acceptable and would have had it reiterated by planning and zoning and the council. Councilmember Urich stated it should be clear enough that the planning and zoning commission and the council are not seeing the same things over and over again. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated an applicant can submit whatever they want to submit as long as they pay their fee,and the application has to be processed,whether it is acceptable or not. Vice Mayor Surra stated they just have to see that list ahead of the submittal. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated that is correct. Vice Mayor Surra stated she would have no problems saying no if they have seen that list ahead of time,and she would not care how much they whined at her. Councilmember Durbala asked if staff was looking for a list of things. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 20 OF 24 Vice Mayor Surra stated that is what they have been mentioning here. Development Services Director Larry Harmer added he is getting that from everyone now,and it is what they need to bring back to them. Councilmember Eck asked if they would still need to have some kind of minumum lot size on planned development. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated they have a certain amount of land on planned developments. Hard zoning breaks down to a certain amount of dwellings when 7,000 sq.ft. lots are considered.If they go to planned development with smaller lots, they cannot go to any more than that same amount of dwelling units as is allowed for the hard zoning.I t is confusing to all of them,especially the use of open space as drainage area,which is what the developers are doing, instead of providing amenities for the subdivision.It has been a vicious battle with them for the last year. Councilmember Eck thought they were at a consensus that the smallest lot would be 6,000 sq.ft. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he agreed. Councilmember Eck stated it also has to have a 55 or 60 ft.minimum width.He asked if it would have to be put in some form of writing or if it was negotiable. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated it is always negotiable but they can establish written criteria. City Manager Curtis Shook stated the idea is to establish the criteria.In the past,developers have stated they wanted to do one thing,and the city has asked them to do something else.The developers did not want to do that and the city was left in a position where without the minimum standards,they could not say they could not recommend this.They could only say the developer would be taking their chances.They could not make any recommendation.They could only recommend denial when things were truly out of kilter.With these standards,they can now tell them it does not meet minimum criteria and staff can recommend denial. Vice Mayor Surra commented that the retention area,the necessary drainage area,is not to be calculated in their presentation of the open space.That has to be hard pressed.Council and planning and zoning agreed on this.The agreed open area has to be there. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 21 OF 24 Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he has seen that evolving from the last few subdivision requests. City Manager Curtis Shook stated he had met with Mr.Harmer over a recent subdivision plan and they told the developer that it would not work.That was with 55'minimum fronts but it was clear that they were talking about 5500 sq.ft.They told them they would recommend denial and the developers stated they would present it anyway.They told them to take their chances,and it has not been presented yet. Vice Mayor Surra asked them to give consideration about having the garages in the front preceding the roof line of the residence. Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated there are different combinations of actions that will have to be taken.Some will end up in the zoning code,such as the differential set backs,which is the garage preceding the roof line.If they put the set backs in the zoning code,it would also be available to the hard zoning. Vice Mayor Surra asked if there had been enough direction. Harmer stated there had been. to summarize to see if the council agreed. Development Services Director Larry City Manager Curtis Shook asked him Development Services Director Larry Harmer stated he perceived that he COME BACK TO COUNCIL AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE WITH BASICALLY A LIST OF PLANNED DEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL OPTIONS AS FAR AS HOW A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT PLAN WOULD BE REVIEWED.IN THE COURSE OF THE LIST,THEY WOULD ALSO GIVE A RECOMMENDATION OR A SUGGESTION WHETHER THEY WOULD BE BETTER SERVED UNDER CRITERIA OR AMENDMENT TO THE SUBDIVISION OR ZONING CODES.IN SOME CASES THE HARD ZONING WOULD CHANGE IF THE ZONING CODE WAS CHANGED. Mayor Coleman MOVED THAT IT WOULD BE HIS MOTION,and he called for a second. Councilmember McClain SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 22 OF 24 SELECTION OF MEETING DATES,TIMES,LOCATIONS.AND PURPOSES Vice Mayor Surra MOVED THAT AN EXECUTIVE SESSION AT 6:00 P.M.AND A WORK SESSION AT 7:00 P.M.BE HELD ON MONDAY,DECEMBER 1,1997,IN THE CITY COUNCIL CONFERENCE ROOM AND CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS RESPECTIVELY;AND THAT AN EXECUTIVE SESSION AT 6:00 P.M.BE HELD ON TUESDAY,DECEMBER 2,1997, IN THE CITY COUNCIL CONFERENCE ROOM. Councilmember Urich SECONDED THE MOTION. VOTE:Unanimous. The motion carried. INFORMATION AND REPORTS Mayor Coleman gave a reminder of the special meeting for a public hearing on school development fees to be held on Monday,November 24,1997,at 7:00 p.m. in the city council chambers. Mayor Coleman gave a reminder of a Central Arizona Association of Governments meeting tomorrow night in Hayden. Councilmember Durbala reminded everyone of the Little League function this Saturday. City Manager Curtis Shook stated he would be in Sedona on Thursday and Friday for a conference on electric deregulation. ADJOURNMENT )Mayor Coleman adjourned the meeting at 8:55 p.m. Consent Agenda Items are as follows: 1.Acceptance of Agenda. 2.Acceptance of Minutes of Regular Meeting of November 4,1997. 3.Recognition of Outstanding Service to the Community by City Employees. 4.Approval of Intergovernmental Agreement with Apache Junction Unified School District #43 to renew the School Safety Program. REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 23 OF 24 5.Approval and Ratification of purchase of shotcrete channel lining from M & S Shotcrete in the amount of $11,245.92. ACCEPTED THIS 2Nfl DAY OF ,1997,BY THE MAYOR AND CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF APACHE J DECEMBFR UNCTION,ARIZONA. SIGNED AND ATTESTED TO THIS 2ND DAY OF DECEMBER ,1997. ATTEST: DOUGLAS COLEMAN Mayor CITY COUNCIL MINUTES CERTIFICATION I hereby certify that the foregoing minutes are a true and correct copy of the minutes of the regular meeting of the City Council of the City of Apache Junction,Arizona,held on the 18th day of November,1997.I further certify that the meeting was duly called and held and that a quorum was present. Dated this 1st day of December,1997. KATHLEEN CONNELLY City Clerk REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL NOVEMBER 18,1997 PAGE 24 OF 24